00:00:06
Matt Waters: Hey there, David buddies and welcome to the show.

00:00:08
Now it's pretty clear that over the last couple of years, the

00:00:10
dive industry has been hit hard with dive operations going out

00:00:13
of business and professionals having to find alternative

00:00:16
sources of income, many of whom are forced to leave the industry

00:00:19
and even go back to living with mom and dad. Some, however, have

00:00:23
managed to keep that link into our watery world. And one such

00:00:26
chap is a good buddy of mine, and multi agency instructor

00:00:29
Steve Crosby. Steve, welcome to the show, buddy. Hey, Dan.

00:00:32
Steve Crosby: Thanks for having me on. It's a pleasure to be

00:00:34
here.

00:00:35
Matt Waters: Happy days. I think that's the first intro that I've

00:00:37
done. Straight out the bat and not cocked it up.

00:00:41
Steve Crosby: I'm super proud of you. You've definitely gotten

00:00:43
better at this.

00:00:47
Matt Waters: Okay, let's, let's have a little delve into your

00:00:50
mate and just let the listeners know who you are and where you

00:00:53
are at the moment.

00:00:54
Steve Crosby: Yeah, so um, so I'm Steve Crosby. I'm like, like

00:00:58
you said, a multi agency instructor. I teach through SSI

00:01:02
TDI and raid, soon to join one other agency. But for now that's

00:01:08
it. I've been diving for about 16 years I've been teaching in

00:01:13
diving since 2014. So as soon as I started getting into teaching

00:01:20
diving, I quickly realised just how much passion I had. I've

00:01:23
been diving for a long time. But as soon as I started to teach, I

00:01:26
realised just how awesome it was and how rewarding it would be.

00:01:30
So started doing more and more and more and more started

00:01:33
getting more agencies under my belts or to teaching different

00:01:35
types of courses, and just been stuck ever since. Really, I

00:01:38
mean, stuck in a happy way. been moving around from country to

00:01:42
country, bouncing along met you, obviously in Thailand, and then

00:01:46
currently in saloon Mexico and have em em slowly beginning the

00:01:51
road to big becoming a full cave instructor at the moment.

00:01:54
Matt Waters: Happy days. Hey, I'll tell you what, I only

00:01:57
noticed it last night when I was mooching around on Facebook or

00:02:00
something when I was bored. Miko was over there at the minute

00:02:03
izany Have you seen Yeah,

00:02:04
Steve Crosby: no, I just ran into him the the other guy just

00:02:07
ran into him on a dating site actually, he and the other guys

00:02:10
were hopping in the water to do their, their kiss Sidewinder

00:02:13
instructor courses. Yeah, so So I actually just finished my mod

00:02:17
one in in January so So going down that road as well.

00:02:21
Matt Waters: Happy days. Yeah, sorry with it got a little bit

00:02:24
of video footage with that little crocodile that's in one

00:02:27
of the senators that

00:02:29
Steve Crosby: are not so good. It's actually funny. You

00:02:31
mentioned that. Another friend who's currently here was

00:02:34
actually on a cave dive like 10 minutes into the cave and found

00:02:38
a crocodile still alive moving around inside the cave. First,

00:02:42
I'll send you the video. It's it's crazy. Like we always joke

00:02:45
about the crocodiles not being in the cave, but my friend

00:02:48
actually got a video of him swimming around and now they're

00:02:51
like go into the cave worried about crocodiles on top of

00:02:53
everything else.

00:02:57
Matt Waters: Yeah, I did have a look. We were out there was it

00:03:00
2018? And did have a Mitch around trying to find it. But

00:03:04
alas, we were unfortunate and he must have been off somewhere.

00:03:09
Steve Crosby: Well, you got a couple of options. Now. There's

00:03:11
a few that have moved in as soon as you come down. Oh,

00:03:14
Matt Waters: Jesus. Okay, cool. And who you? Are you what's the

00:03:19
name of the company that your diver through over there.

00:03:21
Steve Crosby: So currently diving through a company called

00:03:23
Pro tech. It's there's two shafts protect aluminium protect

00:03:27
Playa Del Carmen. I've always been into loom so I'm here now.

00:03:32
And this is protect alumina is where I started my cave diving.

00:03:37
So my first trip to Mexico, me and another friend of mine,

00:03:42
Robbie Peltier area, we started organising a trip. And we had

00:03:45
about 11 of our friends in plus us come down and all want to do

00:03:49
our cave course together. And whenever we asked all of our

00:03:52
tech diving friends, if you're going to dive in Mexico Duquesne

00:03:56
for the first time, who do you talk to? Every single one of

00:03:59
them said go talk to pro tech. We talked to pro tech and then

00:04:03
I've been stuck with them ever since really?

00:04:06
Matt Waters: Now we just take it back a little bit because I'm in

00:04:09
the I've really enjoyed watching your adventure, shall we say?

00:04:17
From you know, bouncing from Thailand to Egypt and back into

00:04:22
the US and then the road trip down to Mexico. I find it very

00:04:25
entertaining. However, we need to just back it up to a man we

00:04:32
initially met in I think it might have been 2014 1314

00:04:38
Steve Crosby: Yeah, there was forgetting. Yeah. at TEDx. Yeah,

00:04:43
that was that was that was very early into me being in Thailand.

00:04:47
Like I'd been in Thailand for less than

00:04:48
Matt Waters: a month. Oh, really? I didn't realise it.

00:04:51
Yeah,

00:04:51
Steve Crosby: that was my that was my very first thing. So I've

00:04:54
just gotten into a dive shop called called Planet Scuba,

00:04:59
which now Longer sadly exists. But I was just starting to work

00:05:03
for them and being a brand new divemaster at the time or on the

00:05:07
road, I still DMZ at the time I think. Still in training, I

00:05:11
needed equipment and T rex is always a good spot to hunt for

00:05:14
sales. So I convinced the shop to let me go work at T DAX and

00:05:19
me not knowing much tried to sell what I could and then

00:05:22
picked up some cheap diver here on the side. And that was that's

00:05:24
how I got my start really

00:05:25
Matt Waters: well. You did. All right. Maybe you sold me a

00:05:27
wetsuit. Remember that?

00:05:29
Steve Crosby: Well, I mean, yeah. Only so many sizes will

00:05:33
fit your body. So.

00:05:38
Matt Waters: So after the I mean, I left, I think I left

00:05:41
Harlem. In fact, when did you leave Thailand? What year was it?

00:05:45
Steve Crosby: So I left? Well, I love Thailand twice because I

00:05:48
was in I was there for Oh man, what was it? So I was there for

00:05:51
1415 and 16. And then for 17. I was away in Bali. And then I

00:05:58
came back and then I works for 18 are like most of 18. Yeah.

00:06:05
And then I went to Egypt after that. Gotcha. So I kind of left

00:06:09
twice.

00:06:09
Matt Waters: Yeah. So yeah. So I left in the same year when When

00:06:13
did you leave the first time? It was the back end of 2006. In

00:06:17
fact, no. January 2017 was when I went to Papua New Guinea. And

00:06:22
then I came back very close to the time that I left. Yeah. And

00:06:26
I came back at the end of 2017. But I went to the West Coast

00:06:29
instead of back onto the island. So I went on to big blue on the

00:06:34
liveaboard. Hallelujah.

00:06:36
Steve Crosby: Yeah. So at that time in my diving career, I was

00:06:39
wanting to go more down like the technical route. Yeah, and there

00:06:43
is technical diving on Koh Tao, but it's like it is somewhat

00:06:48
hard to organise sometimes it's not something you do every day.

00:06:52
It's not where people go to do tech diving and that kind of

00:06:54
stuff. So at that point in my life, I had kind of reached my

00:06:58
depth limit almost on tau tau. So that's what I've I moved

00:07:01
myself to over to Malaysia and did my I did my raid DECA 50

00:07:08
instructor and I did my TDI ADP, instructor course. And then

00:07:13
after that I got a job in Bali that fell on my lap and it was a

00:07:18
fantastic opportunity. So I did that for a year.

00:07:20
Matt Waters: Okay, was it on Bali itself or one of the local

00:07:23
islands no one was

00:07:24
Steve Crosby: on that was on Bali property in Ahmed and a

00:07:27
place called Bali dive trick. org and from Mark crane who is

00:07:33
who has been doing incredible amounts check on him for an

00:07:35
outrageous amount of years.

00:07:38
Matt Waters: Good on you. And you were there for a year

00:07:42
Steve Crosby: so yes, I was there for about a year I have I

00:07:44
apparently have had some bad luck whenever it comes to the

00:07:47
reasons I leave places. So I was there right up until mount a gun

00:07:52
erupting so I was on Bali whenever the volcano became

00:07:55
active and man does that do a good job of killing tourist

00:08:01
dying like flights were cancelled and nobody was coming

00:08:03
in and I was still like the new guy and like bottom of the totem

00:08:08
pole I've been there for like you know almost a year or so.

00:08:10
But still the lower sky on the totem pole so I was like alright

00:08:13
cool. I think I can probably get a job somewhere else if I really

00:08:17
need to you guys stay here this is more your home than mine kind

00:08:20
of thing. So So I left and then that's whatever I picked up the

00:08:26
management job at Rock tapas dive so I not breakfast I've

00:08:30
been at Raj was pros or octopus is split into you got the

00:08:33
recreational half and the pro half and that's whatever I went

00:08:37
up there and sort of managing the pro centre because Pete

00:08:41
Gulia finally decided to retire from that position

00:08:44
Matt Waters: Yeah, yeah, we need a better octopus on a

00:08:47
Steve Crosby: great for sure yeah that mean that's that's one

00:08:50
thing like the rocks was crew has like spread out a pretty

00:08:53
good bit. I mean, you've got the site all over in Malta. Now

00:08:56
you've got Nico in Indonesia doing the rock was down there

00:09:00
and on Lombok on Lamborghini. Sorry. So yeah, so they've

00:09:04
spread out pretty good bit.

00:09:05
Matt Waters: Yeah. Yeah, that's it Westies kind of spent most of

00:09:08
COVID in Indonesia only surfing by the looks of it?

00:09:12
Steve Crosby: I believe so. Yeah, exactly. No, I haven't

00:09:14
caught up with us in a while. But yeah, that's that's that's

00:09:16
what he's putting on Facebook. At least Yeah, yeah. Yeah. No,

00:09:19
I'm just saying so that was me on kotel after, after the rock

00:09:22
was a bit I got. I got a job offer to be on a liveaboard in

00:09:26
Egypt. And I mean, you talked about like Egypt for tech

00:09:29
diving. That was that was kind of my next step. So I decided to

00:09:33
go over to Egypt. And we're there for a year and then COVID

00:09:35
hit so I was on Bali. And then there was a volcano. And I was

00:09:40
in Egypt. And so every time I tried to leave a hotel,

00:09:44
something bad happens, but here we are in Mexico

00:09:48
Matt Waters: yesterday with a crocodile. I do. In fact,

00:09:52
another mate of mine yet. I don't know if you met him.

00:09:54
Richard devanney. Another tech diver, you really don't think I

00:09:58
have no isa He was working up in hockey, remember the name of the

00:10:04
dive centre. Now it's not far from the volcano at all. It's

00:10:08
not far from Liberty rec actually about 10 minutes drive

00:10:10
and liberty Rec. And he was telling me when it erupted, he

00:10:14
had, like, whatever time and night it was just a bang, bang,

00:10:17
bang, bang on the door. And he's opened his front door and sent

00:10:21
some of the staff just sprinting off into the distance. And then

00:10:24
he's kind of realised that the volcanoes going off, and there's

00:10:26
a bit of, like, 30 seconds of shaky video that he's taken,

00:10:30
taken on his phone as he's using his scooter, who knit up the

00:10:33
road and try and get away. So it's scary stuff.

00:10:36
Steve Crosby: No, it was it was it was crazy. It was crazy times

00:10:39
every time the volcano would pop off a little bit. Everybody was

00:10:42
like, just like in the group message. Like, is everyone okay?

00:10:45
Everyone's good. And then like, there was this awkward, there

00:10:48
was this awkward period of time where like, we still had guests

00:10:52
there. They hadn't left yet. And they still wanted to go for

00:10:55
dives. And we're like we're in Ahmed, which is not in the flow

00:10:59
of the lava. If the lava if the lava came. Yeah, so we were

00:11:02
like, I guess we can still dive. So we were still going on dives

00:11:06
and like hearing explosions and like, on the dive whatever

00:11:10
actual earthquakes were happening, like seeing the reef

00:11:13
move and stuff. Yeah, it was crazy. Like that's, like noise

00:11:16
gets louder underwater. And it's a different experience whenever

00:11:19
you feel an earthquake inside your head.

00:11:22
Matt Waters: Yeah, yeah. And did you actually, I mean, I've never

00:11:25
spoken to anyone else who's experienced that as well because

00:11:27
I experienced it in Amazon with a few mates. And okay, just

00:11:33
getting that rumble and movement under the water. I actually

00:11:36
thought it was just a super tanker coming over the top of

00:11:39
your head or something.

00:11:41
Steve Crosby: No, and that's it. That's the thing like the first

00:11:44
time it happened so whenever you're diving in Bali, like

00:11:47
there's no there's no like massive piers around us and

00:11:50
Ahmed there's no like place for a big boat to come dock. And

00:11:53
there's all the boats that come in and like dive because all the

00:11:56
bodies that like sheer cliffs, or sometimes little boats will

00:11:59
like come in, drop people off and then go out. But you're

00:12:01
sitting there and you're just like, I'm way too close to shore

00:12:04
for a boat this big to be what is it? And then you just see the

00:12:07
reef shaking like you're in trim. What the ground is moving?

00:12:12
Matt Waters: Yeah, yeah. It's a weird, weird scenario, isn't it?

00:12:14
And to be honest, when we had it in, in Amazon, we got back on

00:12:19
the dive boat and had no clue that it was an earthquake. Until

00:12:23
the boys that were on the boat, you know, that already had text

00:12:26
messages saying that a couple of houses had fallen down in the

00:12:28
local village,

00:12:29
Steve Crosby: which is crazy. No, I remember like it was it

00:12:33
was such a fun time. Like, just getting the getting the tourists

00:12:36
out of there. And then all of us sitting there and like, no one

00:12:39
was like, we didn't have a compressor. So we were renting

00:12:42
tanks from a different company and like they weren't running

00:12:44
tanks anymore. Like they were shut down. All the businesses

00:12:48
were shut down. So like all the people are just like sitting

00:12:50
there like what do we do? Can't go diving because no one gives

00:12:54
us gas. We're like rationing. How many tanks we have to try to

00:12:58
get through some weeks of diving was a bizarre experience.

00:13:03
Matt Waters: So you kind of did you hotfoot it out of there and

00:13:05
then just stay away?

00:13:06
Steve Crosby: Pretty much. Yeah, I mean, I stick around, I feel

00:13:09
like I stuck around for like maybe like two weeks, maybe

00:13:12
three weeks, something like that. So um, we pretty much had

00:13:17
a had a sit down with, with Mark crane, me and Alexei and

00:13:22
everybody, we sat down. And we were just like, Okay, how long

00:13:27
can we still be on salary if we have no money coming in? And we

00:13:32
just had to have like hard talks like, Alright, how long is it

00:13:34
gonna last? And I was like, Well, right now, everyone's good

00:13:38
for this month. And next. And then after that, it's like, I

00:13:41
was like, well, after any bookings and things and you

00:13:44
know, it's just, it's one of those situations, kind of like

00:13:46
COVID, where you have no real idea of how bad it's gonna be

00:13:50
until you're on the other side of it. Yeah. So we're sitting

00:13:53
there, and we're just like, not sure exactly how long it's going

00:13:55
to last. And I said, Well, look, I'm pretty sure I could get a

00:13:58
job back on Koh Tao if I asked for it. And literally, I sent

00:14:02
Pete a message like that day. And that was the day he was

00:14:06
like, contemplating very hard talking to Dave and Jay and

00:14:12
everybody and being like, Hey, I think I'm gonna step down. It

00:14:14
was like the same day was the same day that I finally reached

00:14:16
out to Pete was the day that he was like, alright, screw it. I'm

00:14:19
going to tell them today that we need to have a talk tomorrow.

00:14:21
Yeah. And that was the day so Pete stuck around for another

00:14:24
week or so or however long it took me to get over there. And

00:14:27
the transition that way, worked out really well. And I felt

00:14:30
very, very fortunate being able to step into that kind of a role

00:14:34
in the situation I was in because a lot of people don't

00:14:36
have you know, if you don't have that big of a diving network, or

00:14:40
if you don't have that many opportunities, it's kind of hard

00:14:44
sometimes. So that's one reason why I felt okay to leave because

00:14:47
I had a hunch that I'd be able to get a job somewhere if I

00:14:50
really, really needed it.

00:14:51
Matt Waters: Yeah. So the position you went back into was

00:14:54
running the pro side of things.

00:14:56
Steve Crosby: Exactly. Yeah. So um, so I stepped into the role

00:14:59
um, just managing the the pro centre. So for those of you who

00:15:03
don't know the pro centre and rocks bliss, so rocks dive is

00:15:06
split into there's the recreational side which just

00:15:09
does the open water, the advanced the fun dives, the one

00:15:12
day DSD, the trial experience. And then there's the whole pro

00:15:16
side, the pro side does pretty much all of the like

00:15:19
specialities the deeps, the deep courses, the nitrox courses, the

00:15:23
very little tech that happens is run out of the pro centre, as

00:15:26
well as the big thing that absorbed most of my time, which

00:15:29
was running the dive master courses. So at the time rocks

00:15:33
was dive whenever I got there octopus had about I want to say

00:15:37
like 15 or so divemasters in training, which like, is a

00:15:42
pretty big number. And then in my year plus ish of managing it

00:15:48
not hugely thanks to me, but just happenstance, that number

00:15:51
creeped up to around I was like, right at 30. Yeah, right at 30,

00:15:56
like 28 or 30 dmts at one time, which is crazy. But also, you

00:16:01
know, it's a minimum three month course. So a lot of people it's,

00:16:06
you know, it's not totally unheard of. Yeah. And those

00:16:09
were, those were some fun times. stressful days. Those are some

00:16:15
really fun times. Yeah, just just passing on knowledge to

00:16:18
that many, like, super eager divers all at the same time, is

00:16:22
I mean, that's what it's all about. For me, you know,

00:16:24
Matt Waters: I think we're gonna probably go through that kind of

00:16:26
transition period now that we're two years past COVID. And like I

00:16:30
mentioned in the intro, you know, so many people have had to

00:16:32
leave the business and move on in life. And there's gonna be a

00:16:37
lot of people that don't come back to it because, you know,

00:16:39
they're now earning reasonable income and new lifestyle, etc,

00:16:43
etc. I think we're gonna see a whole new raft of young kids

00:16:49
coming through wanting to fill those positions become dive

00:16:51
pros. Oh, I

00:16:53
Steve Crosby: mean, I hope so. That'd be really good. I mean,

00:16:56
have I told you I don't think I've told you my like, COVID

00:17:00
story about how I had to leave diving and then come back. Do

00:17:03
you know that whole spiel yet?

00:17:04
Matt Waters: No, no, I saw little snippets that you put up

00:17:06
on Facebook every now and then. But I because I know. Yeah, I

00:17:10
could kind of feel that there was a good story, though. So I

00:17:14
was rather hoping that you're gonna bring this up without me

00:17:16
having to ask, go for it.

00:17:20
Steve Crosby: Well, here we go. Okay. So I was I was working in

00:17:24
Egypt for a company called Red Sea explorers. This is where I

00:17:27
went after I was at rock to this great company that was really

00:17:32
focused on actual, like proper tech diving. So there are a lot

00:17:37
of Liveaboards in the Red Sea, but there are not too many of

00:17:40
them that focus on like proper technical diving, some guys will

00:17:45
be cowboys, because it's Egypt and they'll do silly things. But

00:17:47
these guys that I was working with were the were properly

00:17:50
focused on good training and good technique, and following

00:17:53
all the rules and all that kind of stuff and just really fell in

00:17:56
love with them. God loved working on their boats, they

00:17:59
have some good connections with some different TV shops. So I

00:18:02
was there for about a year didn't actually do any training

00:18:06
myself there. But I did well Christian, I didn't do any

00:18:09
training for myself, but I did do some teaching there. I was

00:18:13
there for about a year and how it works in Egypt and and a lot

00:18:17
of countries you have to be out of the country while they handle

00:18:21
like your work permit or the next stage of your residency. So

00:18:27
COVID was like just starting to be a thing. It was just starting

00:18:30
to make the news. You know, this is like, February, late January

00:18:35
of 2020. So I had to leave Egypt for 10 days while they handled

00:18:42
my work permit stuff. So I left Egypt I went visited a friend of

00:18:47
mine, Danielle Hi. When visit a friend of mine in Germany for

00:18:53
like 10 days. I had a backpack on and that was that was just

00:18:58
not a lot of like a small backpack like everyday rucksack,

00:19:01
not a like backpackers backpack. Because you know, I was gonna go

00:19:05
back. So I was in Germany for 10 days. On day two, Egypt

00:19:12
announced that they were going to shut their borders because of

00:19:15
COVID. And I was like, okay, cool. I can't go back and get my

00:19:20
stuff like all my dive gear, all my everything is sitting back in

00:19:25
my apartment. And I can't get to it sounds like alright, that's

00:19:27
fine. I'll just hang out here in Germany for like 10 days. And

00:19:32
I'll let this whole COVID thing blow over. And then I'll just go

00:19:36
back to Egypt and it'll be fine. Because at the time, no one knew

00:19:40
how bad it was going to be or what was going to happen. It was

00:19:43
like, Oh, this will blow over in like 10 days. I'll go back. So

00:19:46
like two days later, Germany announced that they were going

00:19:50
to close their borders in like 48 hours. Yeah. And I was like,

00:19:54
Cool. can come back to Egypt. I don't feel like it's wise to

00:19:58
stay here and I don't really have the money. To be stuck in

00:20:00
Germany, Germany's expensive place, don't really have the

00:20:03
money to like to sit here for an unknown amount of time. So I was

00:20:06
like, I guess I'll go to my parents house. So I hopped on a

00:20:11
flight, went back to Mississippi. And then my parents

00:20:16
shoved me in like the room off to the side of the house. So I

00:20:19
would quarantine there away from them for like two weeks. And I

00:20:23
said, Cool. I'll hang out here in Mississippi for like a month,

00:20:27
I let this whole COVID thing blow over. It'll all be fine.

00:20:31
Yeah. So a month passes, and I'm an unemployed 30 year old living

00:20:37
my parents. The only job I've had for the past six years is in

00:20:43
diving and all of my dive gear is in Egypt. Have you ever tried

00:20:46
to mail something from Egypt? It doesn't work. So it's all just,

00:20:51
it's all just stuck in Egypt and unpacked and I'm here, I was

00:20:55
like, What am I going to do? So I figured the kind of I was

00:21:01
thinking about jobs to get and I was like, well, maybe there's a

00:21:03
job like encode that I could get on oh, what can I do? There's

00:21:06
got to be some opportunity somewhere for me to do until I

00:21:09
get my time your back until I get back on my feet diving. So

00:21:12
for me the next year in my life was all about what can I do to

00:21:15
get back to diving. But there was never a doubt in my head. I

00:21:19
just didn't know exactly when. So first thing I did was I went

00:21:23
to Texas, well, first thing I did was bought a $1 Mazda

00:21:28
three drove to Texas, and I did my EMT course. So I did my EMT

00:21:37
course because like I've always had a bit of a medical

00:21:40
background. I've been like a lifeguard for a long time lifter

00:21:43
instructor and teaching first aid courses with obviously with

00:21:46
diving and all that kind of stuff. I've always been that

00:21:49
kind of go first responder in certain situations, all that

00:21:52
kind of stuff. It's pseudo familiar to me. So I said,

00:21:55
alright, this will probably segue nicely into diving, it's

00:21:58
probably nice to have an EMT around because whenever you go

00:22:00
to remote locations, okay, I'll do my EMT. I did my EMT, I'm in

00:22:05
Texas. I, at this point, have no idea

00:22:09
what's going to happen on my dive here, I have no idea where

00:22:12
I'm going to get a job. I passed my EMT course. Easy breezy. And

00:22:15
I go to indeed.com, which is a website that like North

00:22:20
Americans used to find a job. And I just typed in, like COVID

00:22:23
EMT into the search bar. It click and then I filtered by

00:22:28
highest paying. And then I just applied and the first the first

00:22:33
one I saw was the one that I got. And it was a COVID

00:22:38
compliance officer. So it's I I was like, Oh, that is but sure

00:22:45
whatever. I'll do it. So I applied I talked to the guys got

00:22:50
for you. Everything's good. They said, that's great. You're in

00:22:53
Texas right now. We need you in this is like on Thursday.

00:22:56
They're like cool. You're in Texas right now. It's Thursday.

00:22:58
We need you in Massachusetts by Monday.

00:23:02
Matt Waters: How far does that mean? I

00:23:03
Steve Crosby: was like, I guess I'm that's like, a half the

00:23:07
distance of the country. That's that's like, that's a ways.

00:23:12
That's like three and a half 1000 kilometres. So, so as like,

00:23:19
I guess I'm driving right now. So I literally got off the

00:23:21
interview, I packed up my stuff and left, drove to

00:23:26
Massachusetts. And for the next year in my life, my life was the

00:23:30
most weird. Like, I just can't believe this is what I did to

00:23:35
make ends meet life. So my primary job was, or the first

00:23:40
thing I did was I worked on a movie called The movie just got

00:23:44
published. It's called the unholy, featuring Jeffrey Dean

00:23:49
Morgan, you were right, there was the movie.

00:23:54
Matt Waters: What's up? You're a safety officer or something like

00:23:56
that. I think I saw the credit. Yeah, exactly. No,

00:23:59
Steve Crosby: no, yeah, I posted the credit song, I posted a

00:24:01
snapshot of the credits. So that was what I did. I was literally

00:24:05
going around like helping make sure that because this isn't

00:24:08
like the dark times of COVID. Like everyone in the movie

00:24:11
industry wants to get back to work. They want to do it safely.

00:24:14
So like I'm like helping make sure people are wearing masks,

00:24:16
make sure the right people are tested off enough. Make sure

00:24:18
people are spacing, make sure people are in their little

00:24:20
groups. And I'm just like, organising stuff, all of the

00:24:24
last men. And a lot of people are telling me like, wow, you're

00:24:28
like really good at this. And I realise that years of Scuba

00:24:32
diving, which is like always getting organised at the last

00:24:35
second. But it happened to be like really organised really

00:24:38
fast has actually trained me really well to work in the movie

00:24:41
industry. That's the same everything gets organised at the

00:24:43
last minute, but it has to be perfect and it has to be safe.

00:24:47
So I did that job for a couple months. And you at the end of

00:24:53
that job. I was like alright, I was like making good money. I

00:24:56
was like, I don't know what I'm gonna do after this. And after

00:24:59
that movie Me and like five other guys who have done that

00:25:02
job, we were the first people in the US to do it because that was

00:25:04
the first movie to be shot after COVID or during COVID. So me and

00:25:10
like four other guys were all of a sudden, quote unquote, the

00:25:12
most experienced people in that role in the industry. So, so we

00:25:19
rolled from movie to movie to movie to TV show to commercial

00:25:23
the movie. And like, it was so crazy. One job would end in the

00:25:26
next would pick up and then I moved up in the ranks. And

00:25:28
before you know it, I'm the health and safety supervisor for

00:25:32
some like pretty medium budget films, nothing like huge was

00:25:36
never worked on any Marvel films I did work on don't look up,

00:25:38
which was a pretty big, big film that came out on Netflix. But

00:25:43
the entire time, every single paycheck, I literally have a

00:25:46
spreadsheet all worked out, this much goes to rent this much goes

00:25:49
to whatever. And then like 60% of my paycheck went into the

00:25:54
Mexico fund. And like that's all I did for a year. And then I

00:26:00
wanted more work. So I picked up more and more jobs. I was

00:26:03
working security on the weekends. I was DoorDash you

00:26:06
want to have time in between on Sundays, I was teaching swim

00:26:09
lessons. I was doing anything I could. I just talked with my tax

00:26:15
man, it was amazing how many different jobs I had during the

00:26:17
last year and a half. So did all did whatever I could. And then I

00:26:23
save up money to Mexico. I decided on Mexico for a couple

00:26:25
of different reasons. Primarily because I could drive here and I

00:26:29
knew I could drive back if I had to. I knew the airports wouldn't

00:26:34
get shut down again because of COVID I'll drive Thank you very

00:26:37
much. And I knew the for me the most important thing like

00:26:41
security wise of diving in Egypt if the tourists don't come the

00:26:45
boats don't go out. Yeah. Right in Thailand, it's the same for

00:26:49
tourists don't come the boats don't get you don't fill it up

00:26:51
boats. Yeah, you know, the boats don't go out. But in Mexico,

00:26:56
it's all cavern and cave diver. If I have a car, I can drive to

00:26:59
the sun all day. And then I can go for a dive. So knowing that I

00:27:03
can be completely independent, and just continue diving was

00:27:07
like my only thing like keeping the going.

00:27:09
Matt Waters: Yeah, yeah. No, it's a good call. Yeah, yeah.

00:27:13
And what a what a hell of a journey.

00:27:16
Steve Crosby: And as for the Scuba here took an even weirder

00:27:19
journey. Yeah. How did you get that back? Okay, so that was a

00:27:24
super outrageous chain of events. So pretty much what

00:27:28
happened was, I was messaging, video chatting. My roommate back

00:27:34
in Egypt. Shout out to the Reese absolutely amazing woman,

00:27:36
absolutely amazing instructor. So she was nice enough to

00:27:40
FaceTime me. And we would go through and like, or you can

00:27:43
sell that you can keep that and I need that back. Yeah. So we

00:27:47
just like went through everything I owned. A lot of

00:27:50
stuff, facilities or philosophy got thrown out, a lot of stuff

00:27:53
got sold. But all my like most important stuff got put into two

00:27:56
boxes. And you can't mail things out of Egypt. So she had to

00:28:02
contact a Shem contact one of our old people we used to work

00:28:08
with who had the contact of a person who worked at the German

00:28:12
Embassy in Egypt. That person got it to back to Germany on

00:28:19
like, you know, because diplomatic flights didn't stop.

00:28:21
So they got it back to Germany. Person Germany got it to a

00:28:26
person who worked at the American Consulate in Germany.

00:28:29
So that person gave it to another person randomly who were

00:28:32
like both divers, so they like loosely knew each other. Yeah,

00:28:36
that person got it to the states person in the States got it to

00:28:39
DC person in DC shipped to my parents house. Wow. So every

00:28:45
like, like no tracking numbers, like no idea where my stuff is.

00:28:50
So just like every, like, couple of weeks, I would randomly get

00:28:53
like, you know, sometimes you're like introduced to someone on

00:28:55
Facebook and you just get thrown into a three person group. It

00:28:58
was that it was me person A and Luis and a group. And then it

00:29:03
was me person A and person B then Person B, Person C and B.

00:29:06
Until finally it was like I this guy is gonna have your kid next.

00:29:10
And he's gonna ship it to your house. And then I owe a lot of

00:29:12
people beers and many thanks to all those guys who eventually

00:29:16
got my beer. Mike eventually got my gear back to my house. And

00:29:20
then as soon as I had it, the house got shipped up to

00:29:23
Massachusetts, where I was living at the time. Got it all

00:29:28
collected, service, everything that I could and then got here.

00:29:32
Matt Waters: So ultimately, you've got the only set of diver

00:29:35
equipment in the world that is it has been treated like a

00:29:37
diplomat. No literally

00:29:39
Steve Crosby: like well, I mean, because diplomats do that when

00:29:41
they fly. But mine has been on adventures that I haven't been

00:29:45
on for sure. I've never had so many strangers willingly just

00:29:50
handle my equipment. Usually I'm like, Oh no, don't touch my kit.

00:29:53
Now. I'm like, please take my kit.

00:29:55
Matt Waters: Yeah. Oh, well, at least it got successfully back

00:29:59
to you about

00:30:00
Steve Crosby: Oh yeah, no. So got back to me and then um, and

00:30:04
then just waited till December so I can save up the last bits

00:30:06
of cash, bought myself a rebreather and drove across the

00:30:09
border.

00:30:10
Matt Waters: You brought the polar rebreather. Which one? I

00:30:13
did.

00:30:13
Steve Crosby: Yeah. Went for the sidewinder because Sidewinder

00:30:16
so, just finished my mod one just finished by mod one, which

00:30:20
is the you know, the learn how to dive the unit but no deeper

00:30:22
than 40 metres in open water. In Mexico, there's not a lot of

00:30:26
open water. So currently, I'm racking up hours. And then

00:30:31
hopefully soon within the next month or so maybe to do my cave

00:30:36
robbery their course. And then instead of being limited to two

00:30:40
or three tanks in a cave, I can just go do a whole system in a

00:30:44
day if I wanted to, you know,

00:30:45
Matt Waters: yeah. Yeah, I was kind of looking at that

00:30:49
Sidewinder when Miko started playing around with it. And I

00:30:52
think that was, it couldn't have been much, much time after the

00:30:56
start of the COVID outbreak when he started doing the Sidewinder.

00:31:01
And I've got my eyes on it, because it's definitely picked

00:31:03
up in popularity. Yeah, yeah. Well, I mean, it's, you know,

00:31:08
with me having nomadic Scuba, the Scuba travel company that

00:31:13
put that on hold now for two years. But at that time, it was

00:31:17
getting to the point where I was travelling all the time doing

00:31:19
expeditions, and it kind of started to play on my conscious

00:31:24
that a site a rebreather unit would be good for some of the

00:31:29
expeditions. However, a large rebreather would be a pain in

00:31:32
the ass when you're travelling. Hence, the sidewinder kind of

00:31:36
caught my eye.

00:31:37
Steve Crosby: It's a it's a great use for exploration. It's

00:31:40
what everybody uses here. There's been a big shift

00:31:44
recently and just more and more people picking up the

00:31:46
Sidewinder. Because that's you know, that's a limitation

00:31:49
wherever you're wanting to go exploring and small caves and

00:31:51
stuff like that. Also, just carrying the dang thing is

00:31:54
heavy. For the guys who like go trekking through the jungle for

00:31:57
like, an hour or more or they go like crazy part of the jungle,

00:32:01
you're not going to carry like a big heavy canister, you want

00:32:04
something small. And that's what it for. It's a nice small, very

00:32:09
like streamline unit. You can get ones with more and more

00:32:12
bells and whistles, you can throw on stuff as you want. But

00:32:15
I've got the most like just slimmed down unit, less bells

00:32:18
and whistles. And that's what most of the guys here say that

00:32:20
like you just want a basic, nothing fairly nothing fancy,

00:32:24
nice, dependable unit.

00:32:26
Matt Waters: Yeah, yeah. I might have to revisit that. Did you?

00:32:31
Did you get a bit of a cheeky discount on it? Or have you

00:32:33
managed to did you have to fork out full price?

00:32:36
Steve Crosby: For the unit, I forked out full price, because I

00:32:39
wanted to buy a unit brand new. So I went ahead and did that. So

00:32:45
yeah, so absolutely full price on that. I wish I got a cheap

00:32:48
discount. Yeah, that would be I did not get a cheap.

00:32:52
Matt Waters: So what it's ultimately it's resulted in, all

00:32:55
your savings are gone. And you're now back to DoorDash or

00:32:57
you have to buy in it

00:32:58
Steve Crosby: pretty much now. Not quite too bad. So, so me, me

00:33:04
and the missus moved down here. And we said we were going to

00:33:07
give ourselves like a five month window where we wouldn't need

00:33:12
work. So like without actually working, we'd have enough money

00:33:16
to dive as much as we wanted to eat as much as we want to drink

00:33:19
as much as we could responsibly and live a comfortable life for

00:33:22
five months now. Neither one of us is the type of person that

00:33:25
can just not work for five months. I need to be working I

00:33:28
need to be diving with new folks and all that kind of stuff.

00:33:31
That's That's my jam. So luckily, we budgeted correctly

00:33:37
and budgeted pretty conservative actually very conservatively all

00:33:40
our numbers have been pretty much under so we're able to live

00:33:45
you know, not too bad a life on the what we're making now, which

00:33:50
is you know, not like nothing in like the Western world but here

00:33:55
in Mexico, like a little bit goes a long way, you know?

00:33:57
Matt Waters: Yeah. Hey, they die but as I hope you're enjoying

00:34:00
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00:34:40
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00:35:05
message that South America Galapagos back up to Cozumel and

00:35:10
a few stops along the route. And we started we stayed in Tulum

00:35:13
for I think it was four or five days with, with Lani and Claire

00:35:20
and the face. Yeah. And have you have you met Jesse Crieff? Do

00:35:25
you know,

00:35:26
Steve Crosby: Jesse? I don't think so knows

00:35:28
Matt Waters: Jesse. Lovely Lady. Yeah, we did a couple of couple

00:35:33
of sonotubes with her. Gaiden lovely go. But yeah, as far as I

00:35:38
Steve Crosby: know, it's a small industry here, but there's a lot.

00:35:42
Matt Waters: Yeah. And it's finances. Yeah, we did the money

00:35:45
goes a very long way. It was surprisingly cheeping I think I

00:35:50
would probably destroy myself if I was there for a month or two,

00:35:54
not. Not working.

00:35:56
Steve Crosby: No, that's the thing. I was like, we came down

00:35:58
we wanted to have the money because you know, COVID like,

00:36:00
scared a lot of people financially and they everyone

00:36:03
wants to like have that safety net. No, they're okay. So we

00:36:05
gave ourselves like, a nice, big, nice, huge, we gave

00:36:09
yourself a decently sized safety. Yeah. Yeah. A lot of

00:36:12
that's already gone. Because there's always unexpected

00:36:14
expenses whenever it comes to work permits and things like

00:36:17
that. But all in all, it's, it's been really good. So yeah.

00:36:22
Matt Waters: And how was it for? Like talking about work permits

00:36:25
and stuff? I know, it was a pain in the ass when we're out in

00:36:27
Thailand. What's the what's the go in Mexico do is a special

00:36:32
kind of visa with you being American as an agreement between

00:36:35
the two countries or is it difficult?

00:36:37
Steve Crosby: So? Yeah, so So not necessarily because I'm an

00:36:40
American, but because I've been to Mexico before. So I've been

00:36:45
on diving chair. So like I first came here, I got certified then

00:36:48
I came back a year later and did my, my cave stage course, my

00:36:52
multistage course. Then I came back and did some fun dives. And

00:36:55
then I think this is like my fourth trip back. And

00:36:59
effectively, I think because of COVID, Mexico has started

00:37:02
issuing four year temporary residents, like status to people

00:37:11
who had been in Mexico over like certain time ranges and for

00:37:15
certain amounts of time. Okay, so pretty much if you had been

00:37:18
like before, COVID before COVID. If you've been in Mexico for at

00:37:22
least this many months, or at least this many days. They were

00:37:25
like, Alright, cool. We're gonna give you a residence because we

00:37:28
know that things are a pain right now and flying in and out

00:37:30
and all this. So the Mexican government did a really nice

00:37:32
thing. And they made it easier for expats, who had been here

00:37:36
before COVID. Now, as COVID was happening in becoming more

00:37:41
thing, more people working from home, there's been a huge influx

00:37:45
of like, like digital nomads, working out of saloon. And those

00:37:50
people, those visas they can't get. Because it's like, no, you

00:37:53
only came here ever since you could work online. Yeah. So they

00:37:58
kind of were like are so they're so they created this kind of

00:38:01
visa for those kind of people. And also, because some of these

00:38:05
rules are COVID related, those rules are like constantly

00:38:08
changing. I highly recommend if you're looking into it, like

00:38:12
give us a shout. But then first thing I'm going to do is I'm

00:38:16
going to send you over to like my immigration lawyer who's

00:38:19
here, because that guy is like, on top of everything you like,

00:38:22
you properly need a lawyer, yes, if you're just wanting to do

00:38:25
like a three month tourist thing, or even a six month

00:38:27
tourist thing, get your return flight, you'll get six months

00:38:30
and then the app plenty of time is sorted out. But that process

00:38:34
is ever changing because of COVID right now, like so much

00:38:37
has changed in the last just six months. So it's I don't want to

00:38:43
speak too much to that process, because it's changing all the

00:38:46
time. Yeah. It's not horribly, it's not horribly difficult.

00:38:51
It's just gonna cost some money to make it work. And it looks

00:38:56
like because they're so backed up because again, like the

00:38:58
Mexican were kind of shut down for a little bit just like the

00:39:00
US government did for a little bit. So there's this kind of

00:39:05
backlog process where like most people who are starting from

00:39:08
scratch, they're having to wait around five months before they

00:39:12
get a proper like one year residency sorted.

00:39:16
Matt Waters: Okay. So they're coming in on the you got to do

00:39:19
the tourist visa to be there and do you have to get out of the

00:39:22
country while they process it? Same again.

00:39:25
Steve Crosby: So, again, that depends on which one you get. I

00:39:29
did not have to leave the country because of the type that

00:39:32
I received. Other people who have entered the country at

00:39:36
similar times have had to leave and go to a consulate in Miami

00:39:41
or go to a consulate in Boston or something like that. And go

00:39:44
get it handled there. But for me because I have been in Mexico

00:39:49
before COVID I was able to just kind of upgrade. So literally I

00:39:53
went to the immigration office. I handed over my visa which was

00:39:56
like stamped on a separate piece of paper. They took it Like

00:40:00
stapled into a piece of paper and gave me back my residency

00:40:03
card. So like, they just took the visa. So like I never even

00:40:07
had to leave. I was just like, I was like with this changing

00:40:09
hands. I was legal.

00:40:11
Matt Waters: Yeah. Yeah. Deep in rather fortunate in those little

00:40:14
hops through life and so far. Well,

00:40:18
Steve Crosby: I'm a firm believer in like two things.

00:40:21
Number one, always listen to the locals. Alright, if someone in

00:40:25
that country tells you to do something, you do it. They tell

00:40:28
you to go to a restaurant, you do it. Do some research, if you

00:40:31
want, if you don't have any friends in the area, all right.

00:40:33
But if you got a friend in the area, go and do it. They say,

00:40:36
that's number one. Number two, anytime I'm in a new situation,

00:40:40
I always act like I have no idea what I'm doing, because I

00:40:44
usually don't if it isn't Scuba diving. So if I go up to the

00:40:48
immigration lawyer, and I'm like, Hey, man, I don't know

00:40:51
what I'm doing. Can you help me, please? He's like, Oh, yeah, I

00:40:54
know how to do this. And like, people are just so much kinder.

00:40:57
As long as you just like, I feel like people are kind if you just

00:41:00
open up to them, and you say, like, I don't know how to do

00:41:03
this. Will you please help me? Yeah, and people do it. But if

00:41:06
you go in there like slinging an attitude, or with your nose up

00:41:09
or whatever, no, it never works. Yeah, always go in and be like,

00:41:12
I have no idea how to do this. Will you please help me I'm a

00:41:14
helpless random guy. People usually respond much better to

00:41:18
that.

00:41:20
Matt Waters: And how many people have asked if you're actually

00:41:22
Seth Rogen, since you've been down there?

00:41:25
Steve Crosby: Legitimately once a week, as soon as someone says

00:41:27
it, I start talking differently. So now my voice is gonna change.

00:41:33
Because I'm thinking about Seth Rogen. On average for the past

00:41:37
15 years. It's happened once a week.

00:41:39
Matt Waters: Yeah, yeah. And what's the what's the master

00:41:44
plan? So you've got a you've got four years. visa status. So are

00:41:51
you I've got, yeah, gone.

00:41:55
Steve Crosby: So I've got four years legal at the moment. I'm

00:41:59
currently so now that I'm legal. I'm currently freelancing around

00:42:01
I've only been freelancing for pro tech. I'm not technically or

00:42:05
currently a pro tech employee yet. I'm not a full timer. So

00:42:10
right now, we're kind of in my like, trial phase. So the

00:42:14
turnover rate for instructors of pro tech is like almost zero.

00:42:18
Yeah. So you'll see, you know, like, recreational shops with

00:42:22
really high turnover rates. But at pro tech, it's crazy. Like

00:42:26
people just like they just stay there. Because it's a great

00:42:29
shop. It's great people start training. And if you want to

00:42:31
hang around, if you want to be a better diver, you hang around

00:42:33
divers were better than you. And that's why I'm going to be a

00:42:36
project. So that's why I want to be for these four years right

00:42:40
now. I'm in my like, trial period, starting to do some work

00:42:43
for them. They're seeing how I work because they've only known

00:42:45
me as you know, customer friends. guy on the street. They

00:42:50
don't know me as a co worker. Yeah, yeah. So I'm going through

00:42:54
that process right now just doing the freelancing thing for

00:42:57
a couple months we'll trial period hopefully within the next

00:43:00
couple of months, I'll be offered a four year contract and

00:43:04
then that will take me down the road of becoming a full cave

00:43:07
instructor. So you can become a full cave instructor faster with

00:43:11
other dive shops. But a project they do things a little bit

00:43:16
differently and they just from the fundamental course from the

00:43:20
very beginning courses, everything is super like locked

00:43:23
in and super clean. And they don't let you get away with any

00:43:26
mistakes and it's just like really, really really good

00:43:29
divers who have had a long track record of producing phenomenal

00:43:33
divers. Yeah, so those are the guys I want to like connect

00:43:36
myself with so hopefully I get get the contract offer and then

00:43:41
four years later I'll be a game instructor hopefully

00:43:43
Matt Waters: Yeah. And wow, four years seems quite a long time to

00:43:49
get your tick in the box when you compare it to everything

00:43:51
else. But I mean you raise a good point there I mean, if

00:43:55
you're going to if you're going to do something like this and

00:43:58
you know go into an overhead environment and seriously into

00:44:03
an overhead environment then there's only one way to do it

00:44:07
and that's the right way you know none of this

00:44:11
Steve Crosby: is gonna be clean I'm like on in any other diving

00:44:14
besides rec diving in any other type of diving you can just go

00:44:17
up you do tech diving Do you check that okay you're gonna get

00:44:20
benched you might get been feel bad but you like you get lost on

00:44:24
a dive site who cares you go a little bit too okay whatever but

00:44:28
it can't like you take the wrong turn like there's no other eggs

00:44:31
you know you don't you don't have the option of going out so

00:44:33
like every member of the team has to be like clicked in it's

00:44:37
it's quite serious stuff like we all joke we all have fun like

00:44:40
it's a lively you know, it's not just everyone in the shopping

00:44:43
like super strict all the time. Like we we have fun with it. But

00:44:47
whenever it's time to dive it's time to dive in. It's it's you

00:44:49
know, it's the it's the most serious type of diving because

00:44:52
you just don't have the option of going home.

00:44:53
Matt Waters: Yeah. What's What's the message doing the ship?

00:44:58
Steve Crosby: Just gonna say like granted you Yes, of course

00:45:00
if you go 200 metres and you go straight up, you're gonna have a

00:45:02
bad day. I don't want that guy in the comments to be okay. But

00:45:05
yes.

00:45:08
Matt Waters: They said, don't even bother looking at comments

00:45:10
mate. I say it many times in the forums especially on Facebook,

00:45:13
there's so many armchair experts that Scuba dive and it's

00:45:16
ridiculous. Exactly the only ones I ever read are the ones of

00:45:19
the names that I recognise as people that I respect as a diver

00:45:23
in your man who can you man who complains about not being able

00:45:28
to dive with a dive shop because they say he's not qualified to

00:45:32
go that deep but he's done it for last 25 years because he can

00:45:35
and he's a stubborn I'll get

00:45:36
Steve Crosby: ya know, that happens sometimes. And he just

00:45:39
smile and wave and like it's sometimes a divers we could fit

00:45:42
for a shop or sometimes a diver needs not necessarily like to be

00:45:45
humble, but sometimes people just need to like to have you

00:45:50
know, he's familiar with the Dunning Kruger curve. I swore I

00:45:52
wouldn't bring this up today. The Dunning Kruger curve ideas

00:45:55
like the less experience you have, the more confident you are

00:45:59
and then as you get more calm, or sorry, as you get more

00:46:01
experienced, your confidence takes a massive dip. So you see

00:46:05
a lot of that in cave diving and like I was one of those guys,

00:46:08
whenever I first started cave diving, I was like, Oh, I'm

00:46:11
already an advanced wreck instructor trainer. I'm already

00:46:14
a sidemount instructor Raja Raja Raja, I'll be fine. And then I

00:46:18
got here and I was like, I was humbled. It's a humbling

00:46:21
experience. And you don't know until you do it for the first

00:46:24
time. So like, you don't know what you don't know. Until you

00:46:27
know,

00:46:27
Matt Waters: yeah, yeah, for sure. I'm gonna say I've had a

00:46:31
few cave divers on now are tech divers, and they're talking

00:46:34
about cave. And I did that bit in in Tulum. And we just, we

00:46:38
only snuck in, it's more, you know, I barely scraping the

00:46:41
surface, but the idea of going through little holes and nooks

00:46:44
and crannies really just doesn't appeal to me. So, you know, I'm,

00:46:48
I'm, I'm confident enough to say it's not for me.

00:46:54
Steve Crosby: Gotcha. Well, and that's the thing, like number

00:46:56
one, like, all types of diving aren't for everyone. Right? Just

00:47:00
because you like get nervous doing it doesn't mean you

00:47:03
shouldn't do it. Yeah. All right, like caving isn't for

00:47:06
everyone. And that's okay. All right. So like, sometimes in

00:47:10
recreational diving, you'll have people who are like, oh, like, I

00:47:13
know, you're nervous about doing it. But once you do it, you'll

00:47:15
love it. Right. irata And like, sometimes we'll have some peer

00:47:18
pressure and all that. But like, that kind of stuff is really

00:47:20
like not welcome in the caves tonight. Because like, that's

00:47:24
just not that's not what we're after. It's okay for it not to

00:47:28
be about you. And like, if you realise that about yourself,

00:47:30
that's fine. Yeah. Give it a try. Go for a cavern tour if you

00:47:35
want. All right. See some light. See, okay, cool. You don't like

00:47:37
the rocks over your head. That's okay. You don't have to do it.

00:47:41
All right. For me, personally, I still don't I don't like small

00:47:46
caves. I've been like I've been stuck in a wreck before and ever

00:47:50
since then. Like I really don't like small things around me. I

00:47:53
like big cave. I'm a big guy. I don't like tight tight

00:47:56
restrictions. I'll go through them. If I know there's big cave

00:47:59
on the other side. Yeah, but most of the time I try and avoid

00:48:02
the tight tight stuff too. Yeah.

00:48:04
Matt Waters: Yeah. Like say you're not a small frame. I'm

00:48:07
with you on that one. No,

00:48:09
Steve Crosby: no, but I do make a bad habit of like, Hey, guys,

00:48:13
what's one small hole I can fit through and get stuck. Yeah,

00:48:19
that'd be insane in itself. Always a good time. Yeah.

00:48:26
Matt Waters: So have you have you started to formulate your

00:48:29
own opinions on the sort that the individual should notice?

00:48:34
And have you started to get a hierarchy of favourites and all

00:48:38
that kind of thing?

00:48:39
Steve Crosby: So it's weird. It's like um, I mean, I'm not

00:48:42
gonna I'm gonna take the cop out. It's not a cop out. But

00:48:44
it's like it's the truth. It's like whatever people say, What's

00:48:48
your favourite type of diving is like what depends kind of on

00:48:50
like, where you're at and what you're doing like, sometimes

00:48:53
you'll do this sometimes you have to do that and also depends

00:48:55
on like, who you're with. Because if you if you get a

00:48:58
client and they really love seeing small little stalactites,

00:49:02
like I know where I'm gonna take you if you get a client that

00:49:04
wants to see like, huge rays of sunlight come pouring through

00:49:08
and okay, well boom, I know exactly what I'm gonna take you

00:49:10
and I know what time I'm gonna take you but you like so you

00:49:14
start formulating like ideas of what's better for this or what's

00:49:17
better for that? But every single day and every cave is

00:49:21
like so dramatically different. Everyone who doesn't go into

00:49:25
caves and goes in this notice? Like thanks to the same I had a

00:49:28
girl asked me a wife of a client who was here she asked me she's

00:49:31
like well aren't also known as the same as like he can meet

00:49:34
they're all like so fantastically different. You'll

00:49:37
have like, you'll have like Nick diehard that has literally like

00:49:40
flowers and lily pads in the middle of the snow day and then

00:49:42
there's like, there's some water flow through the cavern die,

00:49:45
which is like always fun to be like diving into current in a

00:49:48
cave. And then you'll have like the pit which is like the

00:49:51
biggest, like multiple cathedral sized hole that has ever been

00:49:56
discovered. Yeah. So like, you get like such crazy like, like

00:50:01
different things. So to say that one is like a favourite versus

00:50:04
the other No, but I definitely have ones that are like more

00:50:08
suited for better stuff. So like, if it's your first dive, I

00:50:11
know exactly what I'm going to take you every single time. I'm

00:50:14
gonna take you to a dive cycle though, so who knows? Because

00:50:16
it's like, it's nice and flat. There's no big buoyancy changes.

00:50:20
It's not like a beginner's dive. It's still a cavern dive. But

00:50:25
it's not like a difficult dive. But a lot of the cabin dives

00:50:28
aren't like difficult dive but you gotta be careful whenever

00:50:31
you say that. Because sometimes if you say this dive site isn't

00:50:34
difficult. The experience people don't want to go on that easy

00:50:39
dive. So no, it's still a great time. Let's go. Let's go for a

00:50:43
dive. So like your first time we take you into a sauce every

00:50:45
single time you see a bunch of light, see a bunch of select a

00:50:49
bunch formations, you go over you see the Batcave, you surface

00:50:52
inside an air dome full of bats. Like there's so much fun stuff

00:50:57
to see. So yeah, so do I have favourites? And not favourites?

00:51:02
Like it changes all the time?

00:51:04
Matt Waters: Yeah, yeah. You mentioned the pit there. I mean,

00:51:06
we did that when we're over there. And I think I could have

00:51:08
done easy. I could have spent a day there just hunkered down in

00:51:13
the bottom corner trying to try and get the perfect photo. It's

00:51:16
just amazing to see.

00:51:19
Steve Crosby: For photographers. It's crazy. Yeah, yeah. Now in

00:51:22
the pit, the pits are special in and I really just want the

00:51:25
history behind somebody that's not theirs. And the pit has like

00:51:28
such an amazing history, the fact that it was discovered from

00:51:31
the cave side. So cave diver was doing an outrageously long dive

00:51:36
from a neighbouring sun out there, and then just randomly

00:51:39
emerged into the biggest room that's ever been found.

00:51:43
Matt Waters: Did you know how long ago that was?

00:51:45
Steve Crosby: You know, I don't I genuinely don't if I had to

00:51:48
guess I guess somewhere like in the 80s. Maybe I genuinely don't

00:51:51
know. I probably should.

00:51:53
Matt Waters: Because there's so many of them, though that they

00:51:56
keep. Forgive me if I'm getting it wrong. I don't think I am.

00:51:59
But I think New So notice I just found constantly Are they not?

00:52:03
Steve Crosby: Constantly, constantly. So the name Sonata

00:52:08
is just like it's just a sinkhole. It's where the ground

00:52:10
gave way. And now there's water underneath. Yep. So so no thing

00:52:14
does not mean that there's necessarily a great cavern area

00:52:17
or that there's a great dive. There's just the actual opening

00:52:21
where, you know, effectively a sinkhole happened in the really,

00:52:24
really big ones. A lot of the time there's a nice cavern area

00:52:27
where you're not properly in the cave, you can still see the

00:52:30
light, you're never that far from an exit. You've you know,

00:52:33
you're not going deeper than 30 metres you're in the cavern

00:52:36
zone, and that's awesome. And that's exactly what it should

00:52:38
be. And in Tulu in the tomb area,

00:52:43
Unknown: I don't know maybe like 1520 Cavern sites? Yeah.

00:52:49
Steve Crosby: But then like, cave sites, it's hundreds upon

00:52:53
hundreds. Okay. It's an absolutely insane amount. Yeah.

00:52:58
A lot of them a lot of them nice. A lot of less nice a lot

00:53:02
of them great state clients and a lot of them not great dictate

00:53:05
clients. And so, yeah, there's just there's hundreds whenever

00:53:09
you look at like a zoomed out map of the Yucatan Peninsula,

00:53:12
and you like just filter by like insurances in there everywhere.

00:53:17
Yeah, it's crazy. How much there are.

00:53:20
Matt Waters: Did you? Do you follow? Cristina Zenato at all?

00:53:26
of you,

00:53:27
Steve Crosby: Cristina Zenato? No, you keep you keep hitting me

00:53:30
with names of people like

00:53:33
Matt Waters: this is the lady that wears the chainmail and

00:53:36
takes hooks out of shark's mouth. In Bahamas?

00:53:39
Steve Crosby: No. Okay, so yeah, I know, I know who you're

00:53:42
talking about. Yeah,

00:53:43
Matt Waters: well, she and her partner over COVID There have a

00:53:47
cave, divers and instructors and all that kind of thing as well.

00:53:51
And over COVID They took the opportunity to go and explore.

00:53:55
And I found so many new caves and tunnels and I think they are

00:54:01
the only two people that are legitimately recognised by the

00:54:05
government to be guides in those those regions because they're

00:54:09
that new,

00:54:10
Steve Crosby: right? There's an insane amount of excellent

00:54:12
that's the one like nice thing so like here until Doom over

00:54:15
COVID Like some people came the nomads and some people couldn't

00:54:18
work so they came so to loom like diving or at least like pro

00:54:22
tech didn't see a huge decline. But there was like some decline

00:54:26
and that gave way to the opportunity for some of the guys

00:54:29
here to explore and mainly I've been friends with them for you

00:54:32
know since 2018. And just seeing their posts every week like up

00:54:37
just laying another 600 metres of virgin cave just found this

00:54:41
this like scandal one of the one of the like the in house

00:54:44
explorers that we have at protect every week. He's like

00:54:48
posting on Instagram these like empty spools that he has. There

00:54:52
was a whole lot online on it. And I just, you know, here's

00:54:56
three empty spools from us exploring today and I'm just

00:54:59
like dad Governor, why am I not down there? That's the one nice

00:55:03
thing like COVID did lead to a lot of exploration in the area

00:55:06
happening, which has been nice because now we have more and

00:55:09
more places to take clients and more and more just virgin cave,

00:55:13
which is always, you know, an amazing treat.

00:55:15
Matt Waters: Yeah, yeah, for sure. Sorry, I was not nearly

00:55:21
nearly asked earlier. The missus Is she in the dive industry as

00:55:25
well.

00:55:26
Steve Crosby: Yeah, so she is a open water instructor. So she's,

00:55:31
she did her dive master at Rock tapas. So that's where we

00:55:34
originally met her. She's now an instructor. So she's doing she's

00:55:40
freelancing at a shop here, doing like open water courses,

00:55:43
advanced courses, fun dives, that kind of stuff. She's not

00:55:45
into, like Kevin diving yet. So to be a cavern guide in the

00:55:49
area, you have to be a full cave diver. And she's content at our

00:55:53
current level. And it's not something you'd like for us to

00:55:56
push. It's like Alright, cool. Whenever you're ready to do your

00:55:57
assignment, of course, then you do your K, of course. But right

00:56:00
now, she's still like a, you know, a relatively inexperienced

00:56:03
instructor because she got her instructor in like January of

00:56:07
2020. Gotcha. And then like, no tours, brand new instructor so,

00:56:14
so she doesn't have a whole lot of certs under her belt just

00:56:16
yet. So she's contends to just be teaching that for a little

00:56:19
while. And then then hopefully move into that kind of role

00:56:22
later on, if she wants to.

00:56:24
Matt Waters: And that's a good thing to do get that experience

00:56:27
now that you've got to that level, I mean, anything from DM,

00:56:30
DM and onwards, I think you need to get some experience at each

00:56:33
level before you rush through and try and get to be Billy big

00:56:37
bollocks at the end of the day, because Yolanda go and bolt it

00:56:40
up. Anyway, that's

00:56:41
Steve Crosby: a that's a that's a really big concept. What's

00:56:46
there's a book written about it by the same guy who I think

00:56:48
we're too far like, the Human Factors of diving, we're just

00:56:51
like, enjoy the journey. Like, just because you want to get to

00:56:57
like point D, like ABCD you don't have to like strength

00:57:00
they're like go from a then go to B and like chill out a B for

00:57:04
a while, like teach the open water courses, teach the

00:57:07
advanced courses do that, then go to speciality instructor do

00:57:11
that for a while don't like if you want to, and you got the

00:57:14
money. And that was sure. But like, you're kind of cheating

00:57:18
yourself out on so much other stuff like so much. So many

00:57:21
different opportunities for growth and experience. So like

00:57:23
100% Enjoy the journey, like do it one day at a time. Like, I'm

00:57:28
completely content to do my full cave instructor course in four

00:57:32
years. Because I have never taught a cavern course, I have

00:57:37
never taught an overhead sidemount course. And I've never

00:57:40
I've taught very the only courses I've taught here and

00:57:43
some of them have been open watercourses for my friends a

00:57:44
couple of years ago. Yeah. So like, I still have so much

00:57:48
experience in this area to get. And that's where like you need

00:57:52
to start like checking yourself. It's like, Alright, cool. I have

00:57:54
a lot of experience over here. But I've never done this here

00:57:57
before. Or I've done a bunch of racks. But I'm in the grand

00:58:02
scheme of my diving. My cane diving is still like a very

00:58:05
small, like minority of my diving. Yeah. So I need to like

00:58:08
start building that experience. Like really, really slowly. And

00:58:10
there are a lot of people who just like rush that. And it's a

00:58:12
shame sometimes. Whenever you see people who like, do their

00:58:17
open watercourse, and then a year later, our uninstall are a

00:58:21
speciality instructor. And they're this and they just

00:58:25
bought a rebreather, and this and then you ask them, like, how

00:58:28
many fun dives have you done? And they're like, you know, less

00:58:32
than 100 people?

00:58:33
Matt Waters: Yeah, that's crazy. Yeah, you know, it is and you've

00:58:37
got to,

00:58:38
Steve Crosby: you've got room for whatever the bare minimum is

00:58:40
for that.

00:58:41
Matt Waters: You've got to give room for that experience to

00:58:45
become second nature. And you know, to have a good foundation

00:58:50
for everything else that you're going to extend yourself out to.

00:58:53
And I think you're doing the perfect example there might have

00:58:56
just been able to slowly progress through those

00:59:00
recreational routes and have that as, as a blueprint, going

00:59:06
forward into a much more complex role.

00:59:08
Steve Crosby: Exactly. And that's, that's the thing, like,

00:59:10
it's whenever we first started diving, the idea of doing like,

00:59:16
have the idea of, I don't know, going 40 metres inside going

00:59:20
deeper than 40 metres inside of a wreck by yourself or like

00:59:24
leading customers inside that situation like, that's like so

00:59:27
crazy and foreign to you. But then there are people who like

00:59:30
that's their goal, and they'll just like shoot it, I believe

00:59:32
it's like, step one, like do a whole bunch of deep dives. First

00:59:37
step to do a whole bunch of wreck dives next. Then go do

00:59:42
some deep dives next, then start leading in like, like build up

00:59:46
all the things as soon as you start combining specialities and

00:59:49
putting yourself in these weird situations too early. You find

00:59:52
yourself in like in strange situations. Yeah. But like I

00:59:56
remember, I remember I did a fun time in Egypt. This is As you

01:00:00
know, two years ago, it was a DPV dive at night, while wearing

01:00:07
a twin set, getting dropped off from the Zodiac and we went past

01:00:13
two different retina three different rxbar diving on. I

01:00:17
went to Haas we went past three different racks with the

01:00:19
scooters the whole time. Being the guys having a great dive

01:00:23
gone up, it was cool like maybe we hit 30 metres whatever. And

01:00:27
then I got up onto the boat and I had to submit it to like self

01:00:29
reflect I was like, cow Lee like doing like, that was just a fun

01:00:34
dive. But doing like a GPD dive to a lot of people's a big deal.

01:00:38
Doing a nighttime is a big deal. Ducati V diver nights a big deal

01:00:41
to DVD dive around racks at night with nitrox on twinset.

01:00:45
Like you start to, like, if you just rush into that situation,

01:00:49
it's gonna be like overload. But if you do, like just slowly,

01:00:52
slowly building up the levels of confidence. And then also like,

01:00:56
it's like having the ocean punish you a couple of times,

01:01:00
because you only really get good experience whenever something

01:01:03
goes wrong whenever someone gets close to going wrong. Or

01:01:06
whenever an instructor stops, you inhale, that's gonna go

01:01:08
really wrong soon. So that's you just got to the school of hard

01:01:13
knocks, that just takes time. Yeah. Yeah. And so there's no

01:01:16
reason to rush it, you know?

01:01:18
Matt Waters: Yeah. Well, I think your message is gonna be in safe

01:01:21
hands and using a bit of wise experience from yourself, and be

01:01:26
patient time and enjoy the journey. Oh, yeah, for sure. And

01:01:31
I tell you what we will do as well, if, if you don't mind,

01:01:35
well, we'll we'll catch up with you later in the year, six,

01:01:38
eight months time, something like that, and just see how your

01:01:40
progression has come along and where you're at Next. And, you

01:01:44
know, just follow that journey a little bit more, because I think

01:01:46
there's gonna be a lot of people that are looking at re entering

01:01:52
the industry as dive professionals, and probably kind

01:01:56
of wondering where they're gonna go to next. And then also,

01:01:59
there's going to be those. Yeah, and I think there's going to be

01:02:02
a lot of those kids that are going to be coming through and

01:02:04
saying, Well, how the hell do I get into this? And what do I do?

01:02:07
What's the opportunities? And it'd be it'd be nice to see how

01:02:11
you get on as well with with you know, planting yourself in, in

01:02:17
Mexico and, and getting on board with the guys at the dive shop.

01:02:22
Steve Crosby: Yeah, so you're officially my accountability,

01:02:25
buddy. Now, as they say, my what? My accountability, buddy.

01:02:30
Matt Waters: What the hell is that

01:02:31
Steve Crosby: holding me accountable don't start to hold

01:02:34
you accountable. Like if you start a new diet, but you have

01:02:37
an accountability, buddy, it's like Alright, cool. Steve said

01:02:40
he's gonna work on being a full cave instructor. We're gonna

01:02:42
check in with you in six months. You better be on the road. Hell

01:02:45
Matt Waters: yeah, man. Okay, I am your accountability. biller

01:02:51
out accountabilibuddy All right. I've never heard of that one

01:02:54
before, but I'll take it. You are now you know, responsible of

01:02:59
taking yourself forward. Good on you, mate. Steve. It's been an

01:03:04
absolute pleasure catching up with you, buddy. And thank you

01:03:07
for coming on the show. I wish you all the best for the future

01:03:10
and the diving down in in Tulum, and we'll catch up in the not

01:03:15
too distant future.

01:03:17
Steve Crosby: I'll be here.

01:03:18
Matt Waters: Goodbye, everybody.

tulum

Steve Crosby - Wading through the pandemic years